USA > New York > Nassau County > Oyster Bay > A documentary history of het (the) Nederdeutsche gemeente, Dutch congregation, of Oyster Bay, Queens County, Island of Nassau, now Long Island, V. 2 > Part 30
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Not right to force him, 6 Right to force him 3.
At a. meeting at the School house Tappen Town March the 2Ist, 1808 the following Question was Read for Discussion:
Which is the most happy, the officer or the soldier.
After considerable debate was decided as follows:
For the Officer 5. for the Soldier 5.
There being an Equality of Votes as Appears the President Gave the Casting Vote In favour of the Officer.
After an Adjournment of 5 Minutes the following Question Was Introduced, Which is the most sought after Wealth or Knowledge? After some Debate was decided as follows: for Wealth 7 for Knowledge: 3
At a meeting at the School House on March 28th 1808, the following Question was Introduced; Which makes the greatest figure in the world, Politeness or Dress. After some Debate it was Decided in favor of Dress in the following manner:
For Dress : 4 For Politeness: 3
After an adjournment of Five minutes a Question was ad- mitted to the following import, which has the greatest influence on man, Wealth or talents. After considerable Debate on the Question it Decided in favor of wealth in manner following: For Wealth, 4 For Tallents. 3.
A motion was then made to appoint a Committee to make the necessary arrangements for the General meeting which was agreed to, and Isaac R. Remsen and Henry Monfoort are ap-
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pointed for that purpose in case a House should not be made out at the meeting preceeding the General Meeting.
At a Meeting at the School House Tappen Town April 4th, 1808 The following Question was Discussed: Which ought to be esteemed the most, the Industrious or the Skilfull? After a Lengthy Debate it was Decided in favor of Skill in manner following:
In favor of Skill 6 In favor of Industry. 3.
The present meeting being Large a motion was made and carried that the old Committee be Done away and a New Com- mittee appointed to make the necessary arrangements for the ensuing General meeting, Elbert Hegeman and Jacob Titus are therefore appointed a Committee to Procure three Quarts of Rum, 2 lb. sugar and 2 shillings worth of Eggs for that Purpose.
At a Meeting at the School House Tappen Town on April 18th 1808 The Secretary being absent William Crooker was ap- pointed to officiate. The following Question was then Intro- duced.
Which is the most pleasant, a city or a country life. After considerable debate was decided as follows:
For City Life, 2 For Country Life 4
Agreeable to a vote taken by the society an oration was delivered the Society, then adjourned.
At a meeting at the School House in Cedarswamp 30th November, 1811 for the purpose of forming a Society, Mr. George Monfort in the Chair. Resolved that we the Subscribers do hereby form ourselves into a Society under the Constitution adopted at this place 12th January 1801. We do likewise adopt the byc-laws as they now stand amended in pursu- ance of the abovesaid constitution. Provided however that we reserve the right to appoint a committee to revise and alter said bye-laws as a majority of the Society may think proper. George Monfoort John Monfoort Joseph Hegeman
James Hegeman Edward Youngs An. Simonson
Micajah Townsend Geo. D. Coles Adrian Luister
Jeromus V. Nostrand Thomas Underhill
Aaron V. Nostrand
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George Luister Stephen W. Titus William Crooker J. V. D. B. Hegeman Andrew McQueen Thos. M. Weeks
Leonard Frost.
Resolved unanimously that the Society meet on the 14th December next for the purpose of choosing officers and to proceed to business.
At a meeting at the School House in Cedarswamp the 14th December 1811, James Hegeman was appointed Chairman. The Society then proceeded to the electing of officers
Joseph Hegeman was elected President ;
George Monfoort Vice President;
Aron. Simonson, Secretary; Jeromus Van Nostrand, Treasurer.
The question were then brought forward Would it be to the Public Utility for waggons to run wider than their present width on Long Island?
After some debate in which James Hegeman supported the affirmative and Geo. Monfort, Jeromas Von Nostrand and Andrew McQueen the negative it was decided that it would not be to the Public Utility as follows :-
Affirmative, 2 Negative. 6
Resolved that some person be appointed to furnish I 1b. of candles, I Quire of Paper, ¿ load nut wood for the Society and that a draft be made on the Treasurer for that purpose.
Resolved that the Society meet once a fortnight from this date, until some other time be agreed upon.
The following question was proposed for the next meeting viz: Which operates strongest on mankind. Ambition or the love of women?
At a meeting at the School House Cedarswamp on Saturday evening, Dec. 28th, 181I.
The question proposed at the last meeting was brought forward, Which operates strongest on mankind, Ambition or the Love of Women?
After some debate it was decided that ambition operates strongest 6 to 2 as follows:
For Ambition, 6.
Love of Women, 2
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Disputants Messrs. Monfort, McQueen and Jas. Hegeman. An adjournment of three minutes took place during which the follow- ing question was proposed by James Hegeman and agreed upon.
Which is the cheapest provision, Beef or Pork? After a short debate it was decided that Pork was the cheapest provision as follows:
For Pork, 5. For Becf: 3.
The following Question was then proposed for the next meeting, viz: Hath the Invention of Fire Arms been an ad- vantage to mankind or hath it not?
At a meeting of the Cedarswamp Debating Society held at the Schoolhouse January 11th, 1812.
The President being absent the Vice President took the Chair.
The Question proposed: Hath the Invention of Fire Arms been of advantage to mankind or hath it not?
The question after debate was decided that Fire Arms had been of advantage as follows:
Advantage, 7. Disadvantage. I
The following question was then proposed for the next meet- ing, Which is the most advantageous way of travelling, walk- ing or riding?
Proceedings at a Meeting held 25th Jan. 1812. Mr. John Monfoort was admitted as a member of the Society.
The Question proposed at the last Meeting was brought for- ward. Which is the most advantageous way of travelling -- Walking or Riding? After a short but spirited debate it was decided as follows:
for Walking, 3. Riding, 5.
The following questions were then proposed by the President for the next meeting,
Which is the most pernicious to health, excess of cating or excess of Drinking.
Which class of citizens are the most useful to a nation the merchants or the mechanics.
Proceedings at a meeting the 8th February 1812 at Cedar- swamp:
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The Society proceeded to the discussion of the Question pr. posed at the last meeting,
Which is the most pernicious to health, excess of eating of excess of drinking?
Which after debate was decided as follows;
Excess of Eating, I. Excess of drinking. 7
The 2nd question proposed was,
Which class of citizens is the most useful to a nation thu merchants or the mechanics?
After a short but spirited debate it was decided as follows: For the merchants, 4 for the mechanics. 4
The Society being equally divided the President decided thr Question in favor of the merchants:
The following question was proposed for the next meeting,
Which feels the most contented in mind, the man who puts out a sum of money to interest, or the man who borrows the same sum?
Mr. Edward Youngs was proposed as desirous of becoming a member of the Society.
Proceedings of a meeting the 22nd February 1812.
Mr. Aaron V. Nostrand and Mr. Edward Youngs were admitted as members of the Society. The Society then proceeded to the discussion of the following Question:
Which feels the most contented in mind the manwho puts out a sumof money to interest or the person who borrows the same sum? Which after debate was decided in favor of the borrower.
For putting to Interest 5. in favor of the Borrower. " The following question was then brought forward for dis- cussion, Which is the most useful to a nation, wealth or knowledge:
In favor of Wealth, 5. of Knowledge. 6.
The following questions were then proposed by the president, for the next meeting, Would it be of any advantage to Long Island to erect a bridge across Brooklyn Ferry? Would it be of any advantage to the United States to have a navy of fifty sail of the line or not as at present?
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Proceedings of the Meeting held 7th March 1812.
The questions proposed at the last meeting was agreed to be postponed until the next and the following was brought forward for discussion,
Which is the most profit to raise, Geese or Turkies,
In favor of Geese, 6 of Turkies: 3
Questions for the next meetings were those proposed at the last meeting.
Proceedings of a meeting held 2Ist of March 1812. The questions formerly proposed were postponed and the following agreed upon for discussion,
Which is the most advantageous way of cutting down timber to cut it all clear or by thining it out, which after debate was decided in favor of cutting clear as follows :--
For Clearing : 9. For thining it out, I.
The 2nd question brought forward for discussion was as follows:
Which enjoys the most comfort the Idle or the Industrious man, After discussion, the Question was put for decision when it appeared that the Society were equally divided.
That the Idle enjoys most comfort, 5. The Industrious 5. Decided by the President in favor of the Industrious.
Question proposed for the next meeting,
Which would be the most profitable to the Town of Oyster- bay To billet their poor or keep them in the present mode?
Is it more profitable to buy cattle than to raise them?
Proceedings at a meeting held 4th April 1812
The following question brought forward
Is it more profit to buy cattle than to raise them? Which after debate was decided in favor of buying as follows:
most profit to buy : 4. to raise them. 4
The Society being equally divided the President decided in favor of buying them.
Question for the next meeting, Which is the most profitable Stock, Cattle or horses?
Proceedings at a meeting held 13th April, 1812.
The Present being a general meeting, the Society procceded
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to the appointing of officers and on canvassing the votes it ap- peared that the following Persons were unanimously elected, Mr. Joseph Hegeman, President. George Monfoort, Vice President. John Monfoort, Treasurer. Aaron Simonson, Secty.
The Question proposed for the present meeting was post- poned for the next meeting.
Proceedings at a meeting held 18th April, 1812.
The following Question was then introduced,
Which is the most profitable stock cattle or horses, which after debate was decided in favor of cattle as appears by the votes,
In favor of Cattle, 6 for Horses, 3
A motion was made and carried That the Treasurer be author- ized to purchase a Ticket in Union College Lottery No. which is at present about to commence drawing in the City of New York. A motion was made and carried that the Society adjourn till the last monday evening in September next
Adj'd till 28th September, 1812.
Proceedings of a meeting at the School House on Monday evening September 28th. The Society after conversing on various subjects agreed to meet on the Second Monday Evening in October next, Being the time appointed by the Constitution for A General meeting.
An. Simonson, Secretary.
At a meeting held October roth 1812. The Society proceeded to appointing officers for the ensuing three months and in counting the votes it appeared that the old officers were unan- imously re-elected.
The following question was then brought forward:
Is language natural, or is it acquired by education? Which was decided to be natural by a majority of the Society as follows:
Natural. 4 Education, 2
Question agreed upon for Discussion at the next meeting, Does Wealth and Knowledge add to a man's happiness.
ـاء السيروالت وقــ
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Proceedings at a meeting held October 24, 1812.
The following question was brought forward. Which is the most extreme the heat in summer or the cold in winter.
The Question was decided as follows; The heat in Summer 4. The Cold in Winter. 2
The Second question was as follows: Which is the most real value to man Silver or Steel.
Which after debate was decided as follows:
For steel, 4. for Silver 2.
Proceedings at a meeting held 7th November, 1812.
The Society then proceeded to ballot for a Treasurer in the room of Mr. John Monfort resigned. And a motion being made that George Luister canvass the votes it appeared that Aaron Van Nostrand was unanimously elected Treasurer of this Society to serve till the next general meeting.
After which the following Question was brought" forward: Which is the most Despicable character the miser or the Prodigal.
The Question after debate was then decided.
Miser most despicable. 4 Prodigal most Despicable. 4.
It appearing that the Society being equally divided on the Question, The President finally decided the Question that the Prodigal was the most despicable character.
Question for the next meeting:
Does Wealth and knowledge add to a man's happiness?
An. Simonson, Secty.
Proccedings at a meeting held 21st November 1812.
The following question was for discussion, viz: Does wealth and knowledge add to a man's happiness?
In debating this question it was contended on the one side that wealth and knowledge were more or less necessary to procure food and raiment for man and did therefore add to his happiness. On the other side it was maintained that by the terms of wealth and knowledge more was meant than what was absolutely nec- essary to procure the common necessaries of life. And that an excess of riches or knowledge tended more to make man unhappy
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than happy. Under these impressions the Society unanimously decided that Wealth and knowledge did not add to a man's happiness.
The Second Question brought forward this Evening was as follows: Which is the most profitable to the farmer to gather his corn as it stands in the field, or to cut it up and carry the same together.
This question was decided as follows:
to gather it in the field, 4 to cut it up. 2.
Proceedings at the General Meeting on Monday evening the IIth of January 1813. George Coles was unanimously elected member of the Society and then proceeded to the election of officers for the ensuing three Months when the following persons were elected Unanimous.
Joseph Hegeman, President. George Monfort, Jr., V. President. James Hegeman, Treasurer. Aaron V. Nostrand, Secretary.
The following Question was then brought forward: Does the civilized Man in General feel as happy as the Savage, after considerable Debate it was decided by Yeas and Nays follows:
for Civilized Man, 3. Savage, 3
Decided by the President in favor of the civilized man. The second Question brought forward was as follows: Is a standing army of any benefit to a free country or not? After some debate had thereon it was decided unanimously that a standing Army was no Benefit to a free Country. Micah Weeks and James Frost were proposed as being desirous of becoming Members of the Society. The Question was then proposed for the next Meeting: Whether Avarice is a good or bad principle.
Proceedings on Saturday the 16th January 1813. Micah Weeks and James Frost were unanimously elected members of the Society.
This question for Discussion was " Wether avarice is good or bad principle.
Avarice a good principle. 2 A bad principle. 4
Proceedings at Cedarswamp 13th February, 1813.
The following Question was then brought forward,
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Would the possession of Canada be of advantage to the United States? Which after debate was unanimously decided that it would be of advantage.
The 2nd Question brought forward was as follows: "Suppose a man had had 6500 to lay out in a building, which would be the most advantage to build, a two story house or a single story for a farm house? Which after debate was decided as follows: For a two story house. 6. Single story. 3.
Questions for the next meeting are as follows, Who has been the greatest military character recorded in ancient or modern history?
Which is the happiest situation, the married or single state ?
Proceedings the 13th of March 1813,
The following Question was for discussion,
Who has been the greatest Military character recorded in ancient or modern History.
Bonaparte. 8. Vespacian : 2.
The 2nd Question Brought forward was as follows: Which is the happiest situation the married or the single state ?
The Married State. 5. The 'Single State, 5.
The Society being equally divided the president decided in favour of the Marriage State.
Mr. George M. Monfort was proposed as being desirous of becoming a member of this Society.
Proceedings the 27th of March, 1813. The President and v. president being absent Micajah Townsend was unanimously called to the Chair when the following Question was brought for discussion Whether Genius is peculiar to any parallel of latitude.
After considerable debate it was decided as follows:
Afirmative. 6 Negative. 3
The 2nd Question was as follows, Is Ambition a good or bad principle? After some debate had upon the Question it was decided as follows:
For a good principle, 3. for a bad principle : 5
Proceedings of the roth of April. 1813.
The following Question was brought forward, Which is the
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most detestable character the Gamster or the Drunkard. After a lengthy debate it was decided as follows:
For the Gamster, 2 " Drunkard. 5.
Proceedings of the General Meeting the 12th of April, 1813.
After settling with the Treasurer the Meeting proceeded to the election of officers and the following were unanimously elected,
Joseph Hegeman, President. George Monfoort, V. President. James Hegeman, Treasurer. Aaron V. Nostrand, Secretary.
The proceedings of the meeting the 24th of April, 1813. The following Question was brought forward: Wether Beauty is an Advantage to its possessor or not?
Affirmative: I Negative 2
The Second Question brought forward was, Is Vanity commendable or advantageous?
Supported by Opposed by
George D. Coles.
A. Simonson James Hegeman
Decided by a majority of 8 to r in opposition to vanity.
The following Questions were proposed for the next meeting:
Which is the most detestable character the Slanderer or Seducer?
Which is the most detestable character the Duelist or Scalping Savage?
At a meeting held the 15th of May 1813,
The Question was in the following words, Which is the most detestable character, the Slanderer or Seducer, it was supported by George D. Coles that the Seducer was the most detestable character and by Aaron Simonson that the Slanderer was the most detestable, after a considerable debate it was de- cided by a Majority of 8 to 3 that the seducer was the most detestable character, the second Question for Discussion was as follows: Which is the most detestable Character the Duelist or the Scalping Savage, it was supported by James Hegeman and William Crooker that the Savage was the most detestable Char- acter and by Aaron Simonson that the Duelist was the most
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detestable, decided by a majority of 7 to 4 that the Savage was the most detestable Character:
Questions. From which do we derive the most advantage the conversation of men or women.
Which is the most desirable a public or private life.
George D. Coles brought forward a ticket in the Lottery. No. 22053.
At a meeting held the 12th of June 1813,"
Question for discussion was as follows: From which do we receive the most advantage from the conversation of men or women. After a few remarks made thereon the Question was. laid aside for the next meeting. the 2d Question was as follows, which is the most desirable a public or private Life. Speakers appointed James Hegeman, George Luister, George Monfoort, Jun. for private life Aaron V. Nostrand, Aaron Simonson, Edward Young, for public life. After a considerable debate it was decided by the casting vote of the President in favour of a private life.
At a meeting on Saturday the 7th of August 1813.
The Secretary being absent Micajah Townsend was chosen Secretary for the Evening when the following Question was- brought forward:
From which do we derive the most advantage and Infor- mation from the conversation of Men or Women?
After a considerable debate it was decided as follows,
From Men 5 From Women, 3
By the Compiler.
The following is copied from the notes of one of the debaters, (a bachelor) on the question: From which do we derive the most advantage, the conversation of men or women? Mr. President:
It is with pleasure I rise to express my sentiments on this question. To support that sex so long held as inferior to ours, by them who are unwilling or incapable of participating in the mild benign pleasures of Female Society.
Where let me ask is this boasted superior claimed by man. Is it in intellectual or moral excellance. No. I defy my op-
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ponents to point it out, on the contrary I shall take upon me as the firm advocate of the fair sex, to establish that in this partic- ular, they are far superior to man.
That the moral man is more indebted to the influence of female society for those virtues for which he is so much re- spected by society, and to which he is indebted for his happiness.
Is it in his pugilistic strength or athlecticity, let them not be named in comparison with female accomplishments, or let us turn our eyes to the Esquimaux, South Sea Islands, or the frozen region of Lapland. and we shall then see the women who under- take to perform all the labors of the field as much above us in :this particular, as we imagine ourselves superior to our women.
Is it in the military or political line. I must confess that in general men have been superior in the art of human slaughter and procuring human miscry and degradation, but even to this position a Semiramis, Baodeica, Queen Elizabeth, The Empress Catharine II and the maid of Orleans, Joan DeArc, form direct and explicit exceptions; when then I again ask is this boasted superiority to be found. I may perhaps be answered in general terms that it is in knowledge and information. On this head permit me to make a few observations, and in the first place I ask, does superior knowledge add to the happiness of man.
This I question. I am convinced can only be answered in the negative, when we consider under the three following positions.
Ist. It does not add to our happiness because with knowl- edge, a knowledge of our wants and imperfections are encreased. without the means of satisfying or removing them.
2d. That there is no satisfaction to be received from the persuit of knowledge. A person who sets out to learn every- thing, will find that the further he proceeds the greater will his disappointment be. he can only learn his ignorance of things of which he before had no idea.
3d. that it damps his present enjoyment by the knowledge of these things which may destroy it.
Pleasures are always damped by a knowledge of the various accidents which momently hang over, ready to destroy it. not
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perceived by the ignorant who enjoy the present good without the fear arising from the imagination of a future evil.
In parts superior, what advantage lies,
Tell (for you can) what is it to be wise.
T'is but to know, how little can be known,
To see all others faults and feel our own. Condemn'd in business or in arts to drudge Without a second and without a judge.
Truth would you teach to save a sinking land,
All fear, none aid you, and few understand.
Painful, pre eminence yourself to view,
Above life's weakness and its comforts too.
Virtue alone is happiness below. The only point where human bliss stands still, a conscious rectitude of intention in all our actions, that preserves; a still and quiet conscience, will never fail to secure our serenity and repose. And where is the con- versation that will be most conducive to this to be obtained, among men or women, the later unquestionably.
Woman says the poet is Heavens last best gift to man.
Th'o nature spread round him her primeval bloom, amidst the fragrance and serenity of Eden; Th'o the charms of earth and heaven, with the novelty of existence, conspired to en- trance his pleasures; yet amid all this profusion of delights, something seemed wanting.' A langour still hung round his senses and "Man the hermits sigh'd till woman smiled."
That smile alone could animate his seclusion could fill his eye with cestacy; thrill his bosom with transport; that smile alone could harmonise the music of the groves and spread a complacency over the face of nature.
Thus has providence in the very event of Creation pronounced the Society of Women essential to the happiness of man, and she who in the abodes of innocence was destined only to propi- tiate the enjoyments has become the allotted companion of vicissitude.
At a meeting on Saturday October the 2nd, 1813,
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