USA > Virginia > The history of the Virginia federal convention of 1788, with some account of eminent Virginians of that era who were members of the body, Vol. I > Part 18
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140 On the authority of the Rev. Mr. Clay, of Bedford, who was a member of the Convention.
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voted so, as that it is known to the Spaniards, that under our existing system the Mississippi shall be taken from them. Seven States wished to relinquish this river to them. The six Southern States opposed it. Seven States not being sufficient to convey it away, it remains ours. If I am wrong, there is a member on this floor who can contradict the facts ; I will readily retract. This new government, I conceive, will enable those States who have already discovered their inclination that way to give away this river. Will the honorable gentleman (Randolph) advise us to relinquish this inestimable navigation, and to place formidable enemies on our backs? I hope this will be explained. I was not in Congress at the time these transactions took place. I may not have stated every fact. Let us hear how the great and important right of navigating that river has been attended to, and whether I am mistaken that Federal measures will lose it to us forever. If a bare majority of Congress can make laws, the situation of our Western citizens is dreadful."
Of the connection of the Mississippi with the interests of Vir- ginia we will treat at length when the memorable discussion of the subject took place a few days later ; at present it is only necessary to say that Kentucky, whose western boundary impinged on that river, was then a part of Virginia, and was rep- resented in the Convention by twelve members, whose votes might decide the fate of the new plan. .
Henry then proceeded to reply to the arguments of Randolph, Madison, and Corbin in detail, with a force of logic and with a fullness of illustration which he had not before evinced in his speeches. He reviewed the dangers likely to flow from the non- payment of the debt due to France, bestowing an elegant com- pliment on Mr. Jefferson, whom he called " an illustrious citizen, who, at a great distance from us, remembers and studies our happiness ; who was well acquainted with the policy of European nations, and who, amid the splendor and dissipation of courts, yet thinks of bills of rights and those despised little things called maxims ;" and speaking of Louis the Sixteenth as "that great friend of America." He reviewed our relations with Spain and with Holland, and showed with great plausibility that we had nothing to fear from them. He then examined the arguments of Randolph, drawn from our position in respect of the neighboring States, and gave his reasons for concluding that neither Mary-
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land nor Pennsylvania would give us serious trouble. He reviewed our Indian relations, and showed that there was no cause for alarm in that quarter, closing this branch of this sub- ject in these words : " You will sip sorrow, to use a vulgar phrase, if you want any other security than the laws of Virginia."
He adduced the authority of several eminent citizens to prove the consolidating tenderness of the new plan, and asked " if any one who heard him could restrain his indignation at a system which takes from the State legislatures the care and the preserva- tion of the interests of the people. One hundred and eighty representatives, the choice of the people of Virginia, not to be trusted with their interests ! They are a mobbish, suspected herd. So degrading an indignity, so flagrant an outrage on the States, so vile a suspicion, is humiliating to my mind, and to the minds of many others." He ridiculed the notion that a change of gov- ernment could pay the debts of the people. "At present," he said, "you buy too much, and make too little to pay. The evils that attend us lie in extravagance and want of industry, and can only be removed by assiduity and economy. Perhaps we shall be told by gentlemen that these things will happen, because the administration is to be taken from us and placed in the hands of the luminous few, who will pay different attention, and be more studiously careful than we can be supposed to be."
With respect to the economical operation of the new govern- ment, he urged that the national expenses would be increased by it tenfold. "I might tell you," he said, "of a standing army, of a great powerful navy, of a long and rapacious train of officers and dependents, independent of the president, senators, and representatives, whose compensations are without limitation. How are our debts to be discharged when the expenses of gov- ernment are so greatly augmented? The defects of this system are so numerous and palpable, and so many States object to it, no union can be expected unless it be amended. Let us take a review of the facts." He then examined the condition of the different States at length, ending his remarks on this topic with these words : " Without a radical alteration of this plan, sir, the States will never be embraced in one federal pale. If you attempt to force it down men's throats and call it union dreadful conse- quences must follow."
He now urged upon Randolph the inconsistency of his course
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in relation to the adoption of the Constitution. "The gentle-
to arise from it. When we are on the subject of union and dan- man has said a great deal of disunion and the dangers that are
gers, let me ask him how will his present doctrine hold with what has happened ? Is it consistent with that noble and disinter-
dangers which now appear to him so formidable? He saw all not tell us that he withheld his signature? Where then were the ested conduct which he displayed on a former occasion? Did he
America eagerly confiding that the result of their deliberations would remove our distresses. He saw all America acting under
situation, and our partiality for the members of that Convention ; the impulses of hope, expectation, and anxiety arising from our magnanimously and nobly refused to approve it. He was not yet, his enlightened mind, knowing that system to be defective, the dictates of his own judgment, and a better judgment than I led by the illumined, the illustrious few. He was actuated by
can form. He did not stand out of the way of information. He
ence between right and wrong does not fluctuate. It is immu- tions have a few months brought about? The internal differ- must have been possessed of every intelligence. What altera-
table. I ask this question as a public man, and out of no par-
ticular view. I wish, as such, to consult every source of infor-
mation, to form my judgment on so awful a question. I had the
doubt of the propriety of that system. When I found my hon- despite of the approbation of that great Federal Convention, to · sidered his opinion as a great authority. He taught me, sir, in highest respect for the honorable gentleman's abilities. I con-
orable friend in the number of those who doubted, I began to
I coincided with him in opinion. I shall be a
doubt also. which led him to withhold his signature. If he thinks now dif- staunch and faithful disciple of his. I applaud that magnanimity
ferently, he is as free as I am. Such is my situation, that, as a poor individual, I look for information everywhere." He con- tinued : " This Government is so new it wants a name. I wish
its other novelties_ were as harmless as this. The gentleman
followed the example of the most glorious, magnanimous, and never had an American President. In making a dictator, we told us that we had an American dictator in the year 1781-we
Rome had furnished us with an illustrious example. America skillful nations. In great dangers this power has been given.
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found a person worthy of that trust ; she looked to Virginia for him. We gave a dictatorial power to hands that used it glori- ously ; and which were rendered more glorious by surrendering it up. Where is there a breed of such dictators ? Shall we find a set of American presidents of such a breed ? Will the Ameri- can President come and lay prostrate at the feet of Congress his laurels? I fear there are few men who can be trusted on that head. The glorious republic of Holland has erected monuments of her warlike intrepidity and valor, yet she is now totally ruined by a Stadt-holder-a Dutch president." He then drew some seemingly apposite illustrations from the policy of the Dutch in favor of his views. He touched one of the arguments of Corbin, in passing which that gentleman drew from the domestic legis- lation of Virginia. "Why," he said, " did it please the gentle- man to bestow such epithets on our country ? Have the worms taken possession of the wood, that our strong vessel-our politi- cal vessel has sprung a leak ? He may know better than I, but I consider such epithets to be most illiberal and unwarrantable aspersions on our laws. The system of laws under which we live has been tried and found to suit our genius. I trust we shall not change this happy system." Then, turning to Corbin, he said : "Till I see that gentleman following after and pursuing other objects than those which prevent the great objects of human legislation, pardon me if I withhold my assent."
When he had discoursed on the subject of forming new codes of law, of the nature of the various checks which were regarded as sufficient to prevent federal usurpation, of the abuses of im- plied powers, of the complicated union of State and Federal collectors, he argued with great earnestness in opposition to that part of the Constitution which gives to Congress jurisdiction over forts and arsenals in the State. "Congress," he said, "you sell to Congress such places as are proper for these, within your State, you will not be consistent after adoption. It results, there- fore, clearly that you are to give into their hands all such places as are fit for strongholds. When you have those fortifications and garrisons within your State, your State legislature will have no power over them, though they see the most dangerous insults offered to the people daily. They are also to have mag- azines in each State. These depositories for arms, though within the States, will be free from the control of its legislature. Are
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we at last brought to such a humiliating and debasing degrada- tion, that we cannot be trusted with arms for our own defence ? If our defence be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety or equal safety to us, as in our own hands? If our legislature be unworthy of legislating for every foot of land in this State, they are unworthy of saying another word."
He showed that by the power of taxation and by the right to raise armies, Congress would possess the power of the purse and the power of the sword, and sought to prove that, without a miracle, no nation could retain its liberty, after the loss of the purse and the sword. He contended that requisitions were the proper means of collecting money from the States, and appealed to Randolph, as he said "he was a child of the Revolution,"141 whether he did not recollect with gratitude the glorious effects · of requisitions throughout the war.
He thus animadverted upon the definition which Madison had given of the new plan : "We are told," he said, " that this new government, collectively taken, is without an example; that it is national in this part and federal in that part, &c. We may be amused, if we please, by a treatise of political anatomy. In the brain it is national ; the stamina are federal-some limbs are fed- eral, some national. The senators are to be voted for by the State legislatures ; so far it is federal. Individuals choose the . members of the first branch; here it is national. It is federal in conferring general powers ; but national in retaining them. It is not to be supported by the States-the pockets of individuals are to be searched for its maintenance. What signifies it to me that you have the most curious anatomical description of it on its creation ? To all the common purposes of legislation it is a great CONSOLIDATION of government. You are not to have the right to legislate in any but trivial cases. You are not to touch private contracts. You are not to have the rights of having arms on your own defences. You cannot be trusted with dealing out justice between man and man. What shall the States have to
141 Randolph opened his speech to which Henry was replying with the words: "I am a child of the Revolution." The reader must keep in mind Henry's inimitable powers of acting, and his ability by a mere accent on a word or a look to raise the laughter of both friends and foes.
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do? Take care of the poor, repair and make highways, erect bridges, and so on, and so on. Abolish the State legislatures at once. What purposes should they be continued for ? Our Leg- islature will indeed be a ludicrous spectacle. One hundred and eighty men marching in solemn farcical procession, exhibiting a mournful proof of the lost liberty of their country, without the power of restoring it. But, sir. we have the consolation that it is a mixed government ; that is, it may work sorely on your neck; but you will have some comfort by saying that it was a federal government on its origin !''142
"I am constrained," he added, "to make a few remarks on the absurdity of adopting this system, and relying on the chance of getting it amended afterwards. When it is confessed to be replete with defects, is it not offering to insult your understand- ings to attempt to reason you out of the propriety of rejecting it till it be amended ? Does it not insult your judgments to tell you adopt first and then amend ? Is your rage for novelty so great that you are first to sign and seal and then to retract ? Is it possible to conceive a greater solecism? I am at a loss what to say. You agree to bind yourselves hand and foot-for the sake of what ? Of being unbound. You go into a dungeon-for what ? To get out. Is there no danger when you go in that the bolts of federal authority shall shut you in ? Human nature will never part from power." After illustrating his position by facts drawn from the history of Europe, and paying a compliment to the younger Pitt on account of his opinions favorable to reform in the British Constitution, he closed his argument on this point
142 I have heard that this passage, of which we have but a condensed report, and which blended irony and pathos in a remarkable degree, was delivered with transcendant effect. On one of the occasions which the reporter passes over with some such remark as, "Here Mr. Henry declaimed with great pathos on the loss of our liberties," I was told by a person on the floor of the Convention at the time, that when Henry had painted in the most vivid colors the dangers likely to result to the black population from the unlimited power of the general government. wielded by men who had little or no interest in that species of prop- erty, and had filled his audience with fear, he suddenly broke out with the homely exclamation : " They'll free your niggers!" The audience passed instantly from fear to wayward laughter ; and my informant said that it was most ludicrous to see men who a moment before were half frightened to death, with a broad grin on their faces.
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with the inquiry : " I ask you again, where is the example that a government was amended by those who instituted it? Where is the instance of the errors of a government rectified by those who adopted them ?"
He closed the most brilliant argument which he had then ever made with this affecting and patriotic peroration: "Perhaps I shall be told that I have gone through the regions of fancy- that I deal in noisy exclamations and mighty professions of pa- triotism. Gentlemen may retain their opinions; but I look on that paper as the most fatal plan that could possibly be conceived to enslave a free people. If such be your rage for novelty, take it and welcome, but you never shall have my consent. My sen- timents may appear extravagant ; but I can tell you that a num- ber of my fellow-citizens have kindred sentiments. And I am anxious, that if my country should come into the hands of ty- ranny, to exculpate myself from being in any degree the cause ; and to exert my faculties to the utmost to extricate her. Whether I am gratified or not in my beloved form of government, I con- sider that the more she is plunged into distress the more it is my duty to relieve her. Whatever may be the result, I shall wait with patience till the day may come when an opportunity shall offer to exert myself in her cause."
Before the pathetic tones of Henry's voice had died away, and when every eye was fixed on Randolph, who could not conceal his emotions under Henry's frequent and pointed assaults, Henry Lee obtained possession of the floor. In conducting a campaign, whether in the field or in a deliberative assembly, no member of the body had a keener sense of the policy to be pursued in a great conjuncture than this daring young man ; and it was ob- served by those who knew him well that, if his attention had been as early and as ardently devoted to civil as to military em- ployments, he would not have fallen behind the most distin- guished of his contemporaries. He now felt that no majority, however large, could long withstand the glowing appeals of Henry, and that it was of vital importance to the cause which he embraced to break that spell which for the last three hours had been cast by his eloquence over the house. He also knew that if argument could accomplish such a result, the admirable speeches of Pendleton, of Madison, and of Nicholas, would have left nothing to be desired. He accordingly, as on a former
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occasion, adopted a different mode of tactics. He said that, when he was up before, he had called upon that gentlemen (Henry) to give his reasons for his opposition in a systematic manner ; and he had done so from respect to the character of that gentleman. He had also taken the liberty to tell him that the subject belonged to the judgments of the members of the committee, and not to their passions. He felt obliged to him for his politeness in the committee ; "but," he added, "as the hon- orable gentleman seems to have discarded in a great measure solid argument and strong reasoning, and has established a new system of throwing those bolts which he has so peculiar a dex- terity in discharging, I trust I shall not incur the displeasure of the committe by answering the honorable gentleman in the de- sultory manner in which he has treated the subject. I shall touch a few of those luminous points he has entertained us with. He told us the other day that the enemies of the Constitution were firm supporters of liberty, and implied that its friends were not republicans. I conceive that I may say with truth that the friends of that paper are true republicans, and by no means less attached to liberty than their opponents. Much is said by gen- tiemen out of doors. They ought to urge all their objections here. In all the rage of the gentleman for democracy, how often does he express his admiration of the king and parliament over the Atlantic? But we republicans are contemned and despised.
Here, sir, I conceive that implication might operate against himself. He tells us that he is a staunch republican, and adores liberty. I believe him, and when I do I wonder that he should say that a kingly government is superior to that system which we admire. He tells you that it cherishes a standing army, and that militia alone ought to be depended upon for the defence of every free country. There is not a gentlemen in this house- there is no man without these walls-not even the gentleman himself, who admires the militia more than I do. Without vanity I may say that I have had different experience of their service from that of the honorable gentleman. It was my for- tune to be a soldier of my country. In the discharge of my duty I knew the worth of militia. I have seen them perform feats that would do do honor to the first veterans, and submitting to what would daunt German soldiers. I saw what the honora- ble gentleman did not see-our men fighting with the troops of
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that king which he so much admires. I have seen proofs of the wisdom of that paper on your table. I have seen incontroverti- ble evidence that militia cannot always be relied on. I could enumerate many instances, but one will suffice. Let the gentle- man recollect the action of Guilford. The American troops behaved there with gallant intrepidity. What did the militia do? The greatest numbers of them fled. The abandonment of the regulars occasioned the loss of the field. Had the line been supported that day, Cornwallis, instead of surrendering at York, would have laid down his arms at Guilford."143
In replying to the argument of Henry, that the States would be left without arms, he said he could not understand the impli- cation of the gentleman that, because Congress may arm the militia, the States cannot do it. The States are, by no part of the plan before you, precluded from arming and disciplining the militia should Congress neglect it. He rebuked Henry for his seemingly exclusive attachment to Virginia, and uttered the fol- lowing manly sentiment: "In the course of Saturday, and in previous harangues, from the terms in which some of the North- ern States were spoken of, one would have thought that the love of an American was in some degree criminal, as being incom- patible with a proper degree of affection for a Virginian. The people of America, sir, are one people. I love the people of the North, not because they have adopted the Constitution, but be- cause I fought with them as my countrymen, and because I con- sider them as such. Does it follow from hence that I have forgotten my attachment to my native State? In all local matters I shall be a Virginian. In those of a general nature I shall never forget that I am an American." In referring to the proposed surrender of the navigation of the Mississippi, he said that he
143 The reader familiar with our early history will discover several covert allusions to Henry's military character in the above-cited pas- sage The military officers of the United States were sometimes in- clined to assume rather too much authority in the States at particular times. The correspondence between Colonel Edward Carrington and
. Henry (when Governor) shows this very plainly. The ultimate result was the triumph of the civilians in putting down the Cincinnati Society, and the triumph of the military in effecting a ratification of the Federal . Constitution, especially by Virginia, where it was opposed by our ablest and wisest statesmen, and probably by three-fourths of the people.
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"was in Congress at the time, and that there was not a member of the body who had an idea of such a surrender. They thought of the best mode of securing that river, some thinking one way, some another. There was no desire to conceal any of the trans- actions on that important question. Let the gentleman write to the President of Congress for information. He will be gratified fully." He then reviewed the opinions of the States on the sub- ject of ratification. "The gentleman says Rhode Island and New Hampshire have refused to ratify. Is that a fact ? It is not a fact. He says that New York and North Carolina will reject it. Here is another of his facts. As he dislikes the veil of secrecy, I beg that he would tell us the high authority from which he gets this fact. Have the executives of those States in- formed him? I believe not. I hold his unsupported authority in contempt." He thus closed his survey of the arguments of Henry: "I contend for myself and the friends of the Constitution that we are as great friends to liberty as he or any other person, and that we will not be behind him in exertions in its defence when it is invaded. For my part I trust, young as I am, I will be trusted in the support of freedom as far as the honorable gentleman. I feel that indignation and contempt with respect to his previous amendments which he expresses against posterior amendments. I can see no danger from a previous ratification. I see infinite dangers from previous amendments. I shall give my suffrage for the former, because I think the happiness of my country depends upon it. To maintain and secure that happiness, the first object of my wishes, I shall brave all storms and politi- cal dangers."'
14 The bold and unsparing severity of Lee's speech was silently rel- ished by his friends, but its tone towards Henry cannot be justified. Now that Henry and Lee are dead and their whole lives are before us, it is worth knowing that Lee, in a year or two after the adoption of the Constitution, was elected Governor of Virginia. and that when a va- cancy occurred in the Senate of the United States which he was re- quested to fill, his first act was to make out a commission for Henry, which I have seen, and to despatch it by express to him in Prince Ed- ward. Their personal relations subsequently were most intimate and cordial. It is said that Lee, in aiding Henry to exchange his Dismal Swamp lands for some valuable Saura Town lands, greatly improved the fortunes of his friend. It is also worth noting that Henry made no reply to Lee.
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