USA > New York > Nassau County > Oyster Bay > A documentary history of het (the) Nederdvytsche gemeente. Dutch congregation, of Oyster Bay, V. 10 > Part 4
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Mr. George M. Monfort was proposed as being desirous of becoming a member of this Society.
Proceedings the 27th of March, 1813. The President and v. president being absent Micajah Townsend was unanimously called to the Chair when the following Question was brought for discussion Whether Genius is peculiar to any parallel of latitude.
After considerable debate it was decided as follows:
Afirmative. 6 Negative. 3
The 2nd Question was as follows, Is Ambition a good or bad principle? After some debate had upon the Question it was decided as follows:
For a good principle, 3. for a bad principle : 5
Proceedings of the roth of April. 1813.
The following Question was brought forward, Which is the
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most detestable character the Gamster or the Drunkard. After a lengthy debate it was decided as follows:
For the Gamster, 2 Drunkard. 5.
Proceedings of the General Meeting the 12th of April, 1813.
After settling with the Treasurer the Meeting proceeded to the election of officers and the following were unanimously elected,
Joseph Hegeman, President. George Monfoort, V. President. James Hegeman, Treasurer. Aaron V. Nostrand, Secretary.
The proceedings of the meeting the 24th of April, 1813. The following Question was brought forward: Wether Beauty is an Advantage to its possessor or not?
Affirmative: I Negative 2
The Second Question brought forward was. Is Vanity
commendable or advantageous?
Supported by George D. Coles.
Opposed by
A. Simonson James Hegeman
Decided by a majority of 8 to I in opposition to vanity.
The following Questions were proposed for the next meeting:
Which is the most detestable character the Slanderer or Seducer?
Which is the most detestable character the Duelist or Scalping Savage?
At a meeting held the 15th of May 1813,
The Question was in the following words, Which is the most detestable character, the Slanderer or Seducer, it was supported by George D. Coles that the Seducer was the most detestable character and by Aaron Simonson that the Slanderer was the most detestable, after a considerable debate it was de- cided by a Majority of 8 to 3 that the seducer was the most detestable character, the second Question for Discussion was as follows: Which is the most detestable Character the Duelist or the Scalping Savage, it was supported by James Hegeman and William Crooker that the Savage was the most detestable Char- acter and by Aaron Simonson that the Duelist was the most
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detestable, decided by a majority of 7 to 4 that the Savage was the most detestable Character:
Questions. From which do we derive the most advantage the conversation of men or women.
Which is the most desirable a public or private life.
George D. Coles brought forward a ticket in the Lottery. No. 22053.
At a meeting held the 12th of June 1813,
Question for discussion was as follows: From which do we receive the most advantage from the conversation of men or women. After a few remarks made thereon the Question was laid aside for the next meeting. the 2d Question was as follows, which is the most desirable a public or private Life. Speakers appointed James Hegeman, George Luister, George Monfoort, Jun. for private life Aaron V. Nostrand, Aaron Simonson, Edward Young, for public life. After a considerable debate it was decided by the casting vote of the President in favour of a private life.
At a meeting on Saturday the 7th of August 1813.
The Secretary being absent Micajah Townsend was chosen Secretary for the Evening when the following Question was brought forward:
From which do we derive the most advantage and Infor- mation from the conversation of Men or Women?
After a considerable debate it was decided as follows,
From Men 5 From Women, 3 By the Compiler.
The following is copied from the notes of one of the debaters, (a bachelor) on the question: From which do we derive the most advantage, the conversation of men or women? Mr. President:
It is with pleasure I rise to express my sentiments on this question. To support that sex so long held as inferior to ours, by them who are unwilling or incapable of participating in the mild benign pleasures of Female Society.
Where let me ask is this boasted superior claimed by man. Is it in intellectual or moral excellance. No. I defy my op-
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ponents to point it out, on the contrary I shall take upon me as the firm advocate of the fair sex, to establish that in this partic- ular, they are far superior to man.
That the moral man is more indebted to the influence of female society for those virtues for which he is so much re- spected by society, and to which he is indebted for his happiness.
Is it in his pugilistic strength or athlecticity, let them not be named in comparison with female accomplishments, or let us turn our eyes to the Esquimaux, South Sea Islands, or the frozen region of Lapland. and we shall then see the women who under- take to perform all the labors of the field as much above us in this particular, as we imagine ourselves superior to our women.
Is it in the military or political line. I must confess that in general men have been superior in the art of human slaughter and procuring human misery and degradation, but even to this position a Semiramis, Baodeica, Queen Elizabeth, The Empress Catharine II and the maid of Orleans, Joan DeArc, form direct and explicit exceptions; when then I again ask is this boasted superiority to be found. I may perhaps be answered in general terms that it is in knowledge and information. On this head permit me to make a few observations, and in the first place I ask, does superior knowledge add to the happiness of man.
This I question. I am convinced can only be answered in the negative, when we consider under the three following positions.
Ist. It does not add to our happiness because with knowl- edge, a knowledge of our wants and imperfections are encreased. without the means of satisfying or removing them.
2d. That there is no satisfaction to be received from the persuit of knowledge. A person who sets out to learn every- thing, will find that the further he proceeds the greater will his disappointment be. he can only learn his ignorance of things of which he before had no idea.
3d. that it damps his present enjoyment by the knowledge of these things which may destroy it.
Pleasures are always damped by a knowledge of the various accidents which momently hang over, ready to destroy it. not
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perceived by the ignorant who enjoy the present good without the fear arising from the imagination of a future evil.
In parts superior, what advantage lies, Tell (for you can) what is it to be wise.
T 'is but to know, how little can be known,
To see all others faults and feel our own.
Condemn'd in business or in arts to drudge
Without a second and without a judge.
Truth would you teach to save a sinking land,
All fear, none aid you, and few understand.
Painful, pre eminence yourself to view,
Above life's weakness and its comforts too.
Virtue alone is happiness below. The only point where human bliss stands still, a conscious rectitude of intention in all our actions, that preserves; a still and quiet conscience, will never fail to secure our serenity and repose. And where is the con- versation that will be most conducive to this to be obtained, among men or women, the later unquestionably.
Woman says the poet is Heavens last best gift to man.
Th'o nature spread round him her primeval bloom, amidst the fragrance and serenity of Eden; Th'o the charms of earth and heaven, with the novelty of existence, conspired to en- trance his pleasures; yet amid all this profusion of delights, something seemed wanting. A langour still hung round his senses and "Man the hermits sigh'd till woman smiled."
That smile alone could animate his seclusion could fill his eye with ecstacy; thrill his bosom with transport; that smile alone could harmonise the music of the groves and spread a complacency over the face of nature.
Thus has providence in the very event of Creation pronounced the Society of Women essential to the happiness of man, and she who in the abodes of innocence was destined only to propi- tiate the enjoyments has become the allotted companion of vicissitude.
At a meeting on Saturday October the 2nd, 1813,
The Question was then read, does the civilized man lead as happy a life as the Savage? after a considerable debate on the
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Question it was decided in favour of the civilized man unani- mously.
At the General Meeting on Saturday Oct. the 11th, 1813. The Election of officers was the first Business attended to, and upon Counting the Ballots the old officers were unanimously elected, viz:
Joseph Hegeman, President. George Monfoort, V. President.
James Hegeman, Treasurer, Aaron V. Nostrand, Secretary.
The question was then read: Which is the greatest curse to a Nation a Weak or Wicked Ruler after a considerable debate it was decided by the Casting Vote of the President that a Wicked Ruler was the greatest curse to a Nation.
At a Meeting on Saturday Evening, October 30th, 1813.
The Question was as follows: Is it always consistent with good wordly policy to act up to the strictest rules of honor and Virtue. After some debate had on the Question it was decided that it was not consistent with good worldly policy to act up to the strictest rules of honor and virtue, six to one.
Questions for the next meeting were then proposed as follows: Does not careless and sloven people work harder than the neat and orderly ?
The Second Question was - Whether it would be of any ad- vantage to continue the Society any longer or not.
At a meeting on Saturday Evening the IIth of December, 1813,
The Question was then read: Which work the hardest the Careless or the Careful. After considerable debate had therein it was decided as follows, that the Careless worked the hardest by a Majority of one.
The Question for the next Meeting was as follows: Which is most respected by Mankind great talents or great Wealth.
The Proceedings of a Meeting on the 25th of December, 1813.
The President being Absent John Hegeman was chosen, Chairman for the Meeting. The following Question was pro- posed. Which is the most respected by mankind, great talent
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or great Wealth. After a considerable debate it was decided as follows by a Majority of 3 to 2.
For talents-3 For Wealth-2.
Questions for the next meeting-Has Ignorance and Vice or talents and Virtue been most rewarded by mankind?
Who has been the greatest Legislator recorded in ancient or Modern history.
At a Meeting the 8th of January, 1814,
The Question for discussion was Suppose ardent Spirits should rise fourfold in price from the Common Standard Would it be of advantage or Disadvantage to the community, after a Con- siderable debate it was decided by a Majority of one in favour of advantage and after settling with the Treasurer the Society adjourned.
At a General Meeting on Monday Evening, the roth of January 1814.
The Society then proceeding to the Election of officers when the following officers were unanimously chosen,
Joseph Hegeman, President. George Moofoort, V. President. James Hegeman, Treasurer. Aaron V. Nostrand, Secretary.
The Question for discussion was as follows:
Hath the use of Tobacco been of advantage or disadvantage, after a considerable debate it was decided by a Majority of 5 to I for disadvantage.
At a Meeting the 29th of January, 1814,
The following Question was introduced :
Is the West India trade of advantage to the citizens of the United States?
After considerable debate in which James Hegeman sup- ported the affirmative and Messrs. William Crooker and Aaron V. Nostrand supported the Negative, the Question was decided as follows:
Affirmative, 5. Negative, 2.
Mr. Thomas M. Weeks was proposed as desirous of being admitted as member of the Society the following Question was appointed for the next meeting,
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From which do we derive the most satisfaction the pursuit of Literature or Wealth.
At a meeting the 5th of February, 1814.
Thomas M. Weeks was unanimously elected a member of the Society and the following Question was introduced:
From which do we derive the most Satisfaction the pursuit of Literature or Wealth.
After a considerable debate in which William Crooker and Aaron Simonson supported the pursuit of Literature as the most satisfactory and James Hegeman that of Wealth the Question was decided as follows, viz:
For Literature-2 for Wealth-5.
Mr. Leonard Frost was proposed as being desirous of being admitted as a member of the Society the following Question was appointed for the next meeting,
Is hope or fear the greatest stimulant to action. After which the Society Adjourn'd till the 26th of February, 1814.
The proceedings of the Meeting of the Society on the 26th of Feb. 1814.
Leonard Frost was unanimously Elected a member of the Society, the following Question was for discussion: Is hope or fear the greatest stimulus to action. After a Lengthy debate in which James Hegeman, A. Simonson and A. V. Nostrand supported that hope was the greatest stimulus to action. Leonard Frost and William Crooker supported that fear was the greatest stimulus to action, when it was decided as follows:
For hope, 6 For fear-2.
Question for the Next Meeting was, Which is the most pleasing the Anticipation of a pleasure or its reality.
At a Meeting on Saturday Evening the 5th of March 1814.
The following Question was introduced, Which is the most pleasing, the Anticipation of a pleasure or its reality. It was supported by James Hegeman that the Anticipation of a pleasure was the most pleasing, and by Aaron Simonson and Aaron
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V. Nostrand that its reality was the most pleasing. After a considerable debate it was decided as follows,
For anticipation-2 For it reality-4.
Mr. Stephen Titus & Thomas Underhill were proposed as being desirous of becoming members of the Society, after which the following Questions were proposed for discussion,
Is man always actuated by self Love or not?
Is Man Constituted Moral?
Does art or Nature form the general Character of a man?
(The Meeting of Mch. 12 was held and a page left for the minutes, but no record made.)
At a meeting the 26th of March, 1814.
The President being Absent Aaron V. Nostrand was unani- mously called to the chair. The Question for discussion was read : Is anger in any case justifiable, it was supported by Messrs. Simonson & Weeks in the affirmative and by Messrs. Crooker & Hegeman in the Negative, after a considerable debate was had thereon it was decided as follows,
Affirmative-2 Negative -- 3.
The Question for the next Meeting: Whether Mankind In General has been Benefited by the Discoveries of Columbus or not?
Proceedings of the Society held 28th May, 1814.
Mr. A. Van Nostrand was appointed Chairman and some ar- rangements made for purchasing a ticket in the Lottery, and that the Secretary notify each member some time previous to said Meeting.
At a meeting at the School House in Cedarswamp the 27th of September 1823 for the purpose of forming a Debating Society, Mr. Aaron Van Nostrand was appointed Chairman and Aaron Simonson Secretary. It was unanimously resolved that we the Subscribers do hereby form ourselves into a society under the Constitution adopted at this place the 12th January 18cI, we do likewise adopt the bye-laws as they now stand amended in pursuance of the abovesaid Constitution, provided however,
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that we reserve the right to appoint a Committee to revise and alter said bye laws as a majority of the said Society may think proper.
Resolved that the Society adjourn to meet at this place on the 11th of October next.
William C. Titus
George Simonson
Peter Luister, Junior
Aaron Von Nostrand, Chairman
John Seaman
An. Simonson, Secty.
Willets Underhill
William Crooker
James Hegeman
Abraham Laton
William M. Willis
Joseph Smart.
At a meeting held pursuant to adjournment at the School House in Cedarswamp on the 11th of October, 1823, Mr. Van Nostrand in the chair, it was resolved that the Society be organ- ized by the election of officers to preside till the general meeting of January next. They were accordingly ballotted for and upon canvassing the votes it appeared that the following persons were unanimously chosen, viz:
Aaron Van Nostrand, President. John Seaman, Vice President. Aaron Simonson, Secretary. Peter Luister, Junr., Treasurer.
It was then resolved that we adjourn to meet at this place on Saturday evening next the 18th instant. The following Ques- tions were proposed for the next meeting, Which is the most pernicious to society, Flattery or Slander? Does the civil- ized man live a Happier life than the Savage?
Proceedings held at Cedarswamp pursuant to adjournment on Saturday evening the 18th of October 1823. The President being absent the Vice president took the chair.
The following question was then adopted for discussion, Which is the most pernicious to Society, Flattery or Slander?
After considerable debate in which Messrs. Hegeman & Luister contended that Slander, and Messrs. Simonson & Seaman that flattery was most pernicious to Society, A motion was made for decision and decided as follows:
Flattery most pernicious I Slander most pernicious . 5 After a short adjournment the following Question was adopted
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for discussion Which would be the most advantgeous to a farmer in expending a specific sum of money to build a one or two story house?
After discussion in which Messrs. Hegeman and Luister sup- ported the former and Messrs. Simonson, Underhill & Titus the latter the Question was decided as follows
One story most advantageous 3. Two story most advan- tageous 3
The Society being equally divided the President decided that a two story house was most advantageous.
The following Questions were agreed upon for the next meet- ing,
Which leads the happiest life the Civilized man or the Savage ?
Which is most conducive to happiness, a state of Celibacy or Matrimony?
It was resolved that the future meetings be held weekly on Saturday evenings till altered by the Society.
Proceedings held at Cedarswamp on the 25th of October 1823. The Secretary being absent Mr. Peter Luister Junr. was appointed Secretary for the evening. The following question was then adopted for discussion,
Which leads the happiest life, the Civilized man or the Savage? After debate it was decided as follows:
Civilized man, 2 Savage, 2
The Society being equally divided the president decided in favor of the Civilized Man.
Mr. George Simonson was proposed as desirous of becoming a member of the Society.
Question for the next meeting, Which is the most conducive to happiness, a State of Celibacy or Matrimony?
Proceedings at Cedarswamp on November Ist, 1823, the president being absent the vice president took the chair.
Mr. George Simonson who was proposed at the last meeting was ballotted for and upon canvassing the votes was declared to be unanimously elected a member of the Society.
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The following question was read: Which is the most con- ducive to happiness a state of Celibacy or Matrimony?
After an animated debate it was decided as follows,
In favor of Matrimony, 2; of Celibacy, 2. Decided by the President in favor of Matrimony.
Questions for next meeting-Which is the most despicable character, the Miser or prodigal?
Which are the most useful to a nation the Merchants or Mechanics?
Proceedings at Cedarswamp on November 8th, 1823.
Mr. Joseph Smart who had been proposed at a previous meeting as desirous of becoming a member was Balloted for and upon canvassing the votes was unanimously elected a Member of this Society.
The following Question was then read: Which is the most despicable character the Miser or the prodigal?
After a lengthy and animated debate it was unanimously decided that the prodigal was the most despicable.
The following Questions were agreed upon for future discussion,
Which are the most useful to a nation, the Merchants or Mechanics?
Are Capital punishments justifiable?
Which enjoys the most comfort, The Idle or the Industrious?
It was then Resolved that the future meetings of the Society be held once in two weeks at this place on Saturday evenings.
Previous to adjournment the President appointed the speakers on the Ist Question,
For the Merchants, Messrs. Luister, Jun. Smart, Titus.
For the Mechanics, Messrs. Seaman, A. Simonson, Underhill.
Proceedings at Cedarswamp on the 22nd of November, 1823.
The following Question was then adopted for discussion,
Which are the most useful to a nation, the Merchants or Mechanics?
After a lengthy debate it was decided as follows:
Merchants most useful. I. Mechanics. 6- Questions adopted for future discussion.
Are Capital punishments justifiable?
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Which enjoys the most comfort, the idle or the industrious?
Proceedings held at Cedarswamp on Saturday evening the 6th of December, 1823.
A motion was made and seconded that the Society meet at an hour after sundown and that the roll be called at half an hour after, which on being put was unanimously carried.
The following Question was then read: Are Capital punish- ments justifiable?
Affirmative, 4 Negative I
Question for the next meeting,
Do the pains of life overbalance its pleasures?
The Society then adj'd to the usual time.
Proceedings at Cedarswamp on the 20th of December, 1823. The President and Vice President being absent a motion was made and unanimously carried that Peter Luister, Jun. pre- side for the present meeting, who accordingly took the chair and called the meeting to order.
Agreeable to a resolution proposed at the last meeting the roll was then called.
The following question was then agreed upon for this evening's discussion,
For which do mankind make the greatest exertion, to procure riches or honor?
Which after debate was decided as follows:
To procure Riches. 2 Honour. 2
It was then decided by the casting vote of the president that man exerted himself most to procure riches.
Questions for the future discussion :
Do the pains of life overbalance its pleasures.
Which enjoy the most comfort, the idle or the industrious?
Proceedings at Cedarswamp on the 3rd of January, 1824.
The President being absent the Vice President took the chair. The following Question was introduced for discussion,
Do the pains of life over-balance its pleasures?"
After debate it was decided in the affirmative as follows:
Affirmative, 4 Negative I.
.
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A report from the treasurer was read by which it appeared that the receipts amounted to $2,87₺ cts. and the disburse- ments $1,47₺ cts. leaving a ballance of $1.40 cts. remaining in his hands. Question for the next meeting: Hath the in- vention of fire arms been of greater advantage than disadvantage to Mankind.
Proceedings of a General Meeting at the School House in Cedar Swamp on monday Evening the 12th of January, 1824.
The society proceeded to the election of officers for the En- suing three months and upon canvassing the votes the fol- lowing persons where unanimously chosen:
Aaron Van Nostrand, President. John Seaman, Vice President. William C. Titus, Secretary, Peter Luister, Jun., Treasurer.
The Society after paying in the Quarterly dues Proceeded to discuss the following question, Hath the Invention of fire arms been of greater advantage than Disadvantage to Mankind.
After an animated and Lengthy debate it was Decided as follows,
Advantage, 3. Disadvantage, 3
The President Decided that the invention had been of more advantage than Disadvantage.
Question for the Next Meeting, Which would be of the Most Utility to the Community, For a Man to have an Independent Fortune or a Liberal Education?
The Speakers were appointed on the Question:
Messrs. Hegeman and Simonson for Wealth.
Messrs. Crooker and Titus for Education.
Proceedings at Cedar Swamp School house on the 17th Jan. 1824.
The following Question was then read : Which would be of the most utility to the Community, for a Man to have an Independent Fortune or a Liberal Education. After a Lengthy Debate it was decided as follows:
Independent Fortune. 3 Education, 3.
It was Decided by the Casting Vote of the President That an Independent fortune was of the most utility to the Community.
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Question for future Discussion Is Language Natural to Mankind or is it acquired by Education ?
Is pleasure confined to any one part of the World more than another.
Proceedings at the Schoolhouse in Cedar swamp on the 31st of Jany. 1824.
The following Question was read: Is language Natural to Mankind or is it Acquired by Education ?
After a Debate it was decided as follows:
Natural, 3. Education. I
Question for next Meeting, Is pleasure confined to any one part of the World more than Another ?
At a meeting at the Schoolhouse in Cedarswamp on Feb. 28th, 1824, The President and Vice President Being Absent A Motion was made and unanimously Carried that Aron Simonson Pre- side for the Present Meeting who accordingly after having taken the Chair and the Meeting being called to order it was Resolved that the President draw upon the Treasury for the sum of two dollars, for the purchase of a ticket in the Lottery to be drawn in March next, and that the Members Present make up the deficiency and that those members absent By paying up all arrearages due the Society and paying their equal pro- portions for the purchase of the ticket at or before the next meeting of the Society, shall be entitled to their proportion of any prize which may be drawn by such ticket. After said Resolution being past the Proceedings of the last Meeting Being read the following question was read for discussion, is Pleasure confined to one part of the World more than another? Affirmative I Negative. 2
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