USA > New York > Ecclesiastical records, state of New York, Volume VI > Part 47
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My Lord,
Your Lordships most obedient and humble Servant, H. Moore.
Right Honorable
Earl of Shelburne .- Col. Docs. N. Y. Vol. vii. pp. 930, 931, 933, 938.
GOVERNOR MOORE TO THE EARL OF SHELBURNE.
Fort George, New York, June 10 1767.
My Lord
After so long a letter as I have already addressed to your Lordship in answer to Robinsons Petition, it is a matter of concern to me that the Petition which ac- companied it from the Society for propagating the Gospel puts me under the neces- sity of saying anything more on the same subject. That a man of so notorious a character as Robinson should deviate from Truth in any representation of Facts, is no kind of surprise to those who know him here, but that so respectable a Society of that for propagating the Gospel should present a Petition supposed to be grounded on Facts which are not true in themselves, has astonished every one here who has been informed of it. By some similar expressions to those in the Petition of Robinson, I apprehend they both came from the same quarter, and that the Society has been first imposed upon and afterwards engaged to present a Petition of the same kind with that relative to the New Hampshire Grants with no other intent than to be a more effectual means to impose on his Majesty's Ministers.
There are but three particular causes of complaint assigned which are all easily answered and set aside. The fact is, that the Grantees had settled some part of the Townships ; were preparing to settle the remainder with a reservation of the said several shares for the public uses, but were prevented by the Government of New York, etc. How far the settlements have been carried on has been already shewed, and I shall leave it to your Lordship to judge of their intentions in regard to the remainder when I take upon me to assert that notwithstanding the appro- priation of these shares for Public uses and expressly so described in the Body of the Charters, The Petitioners had so little design to serve any body but them- selves that they had the assurance to request that these public shares might be divided among them, without giving the least attention to the purposes for which they were designed and without the least scruple of defrauding the Society of its Rights ; If the intentions of His Majesty's Council in regard to the Interests of the Society had not differed greatly from those of the Petitioners I can take upon me to say that the Society would not at this time have been entitled to a single lot of Land in all that part of the Province. There is not the least foundation for that assertion of being prevented by the Government of New York for great care was taken to give them all the assurances possible that they should be pro- tected in their Rights and no pains were spared to convince the settlers of the good Intentions of this Government towards them.
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ECCLESIASTICAL RECORDS
17C.
The Second Complaint is, That they are altogether deprived of the greater and better part of their Right .- I have already had the honor of acquainting your Lordships that there have been proceedings only on 28 of these Townships; In 24 of them the Rights of the Society and all the Grants in the first Charters for public uses have been expressly reserved for the uses therein mentioned. No failure has been made but in the four first Grants which passd the Council, and as I am informed that the Charters were not at that time before them, it occasioned an omission which has been guarded against ever since; of these four only one has passed the Great Seal, so that the Shares may still be reserved in the three which remaln. This happened before my arrival in America. The Third complaint is "That as to the llesidue of such Lands which are not already granted away they are burthened with such expences and charges as are greatly more than equal in point of value to the shares themselves." The only way this assertion can be answered Is by denying It thatiy, and I am extremely sorry to be under the neces- sity of declaring to your Lordship that there is not a word of truth in it; when the first l'etitloners for these publlc shares could not obtain them for their uses, as I have already mentioned they desired that the Society might be charged with a share of the expences which would be incurred for surveying etc., but this was likewise absolutely refused, and they were told that If they did not choose to take out their Grants on the Terms of paying the Costs of the four Public Shares amongst them, they should not have them at all. The Reason which occasioned this Declaration was that as there appeared on the back of each charter a long list of names the greatest part of which are entirely unknown. The Council joined in opinion with me that If these were the names of real Proprietors there could be no hardship in fixing the expence on them as the Quota of each person interested In the Township would be so small as to amount at most to a mere trifle. By this means the Society's Shares were so far from being burthened with expences and charges greatly more than equal in polnt of value to the Lands themselves, that they are not charged with the expence of a single shilling. I am sorry to say that our suspicions of those names on the back of the Charter were but too well founded and it has since appeared that some of the Charters which have made their appear- ance in great form and under the clalms of sixty or seventy proprietors have been found In reallty to belong to no more than six or seven Persons, which will be a great detriment to the settling of that part of the I'rovinee, and is entirely con- tradictory to lIls Majesty's Orders which are that no more than one thousand acres should be given to each l'erson-I hope by what I have here offered in answer to the Society's Petition, that It will sufficiently appear to your Lordship, how they have been imposed on In the accounts they have received of our Proceedings here, and to which they have so readily given credit. Had the true state of the case been lald before His Majesty it would have appeared that in order to make up for a Loss sustained of 350 acres in one of the Townships, which happened before my arrival, by a mere omission of the Council on their first entering on a new Scene of Business, I had taken care to secure to the Church as soon as I had It In my power a large Distrlet comprehending no less than 23.200 acres .- I have enquired of Dr. Auchmuty the Rector of Trinity Church here, (who Is I am informed the principal correspondent of the Soclety in this Province) from whence this extraordinary information could be sent, but he tells me that he is entirely Ignorant of it, and as I have the greatest reason to imagine that the Society have not founded thelr Petition on better authority than what they have received from Robinson and his associates, I hope they will act with so much candor when they are Informed of the particulars of my answer, as to lay before your Lordship the authoritys upon which they have been induced to present a Petition to Ills Majesty which tends so manifestiy to calumniate me. Common justice requires this at their Hands and the Principles upon which that Society Is supposed to act in other matters, will I hope suggest to them that such a behaviour will be necessary on this occasion not only in support of my Character, but of their own.
I have the honor to be with the greatest respect
My Lord, Your Lordships most obedient and humble Servant H. Moore.
Rt. Honorable
Earl of Shelburne.
-Col. Docs. N. Y. Vol. vii, pp. 938-940.
OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK.
4093
1767
CHURCH OF NEW YORK. Third Church Building. (Fulton st.)
New York, June 12th, 1767.
Consistory held after calling on God's name.
1. The resolution of March 16th, 1767 to build a Third Church on the grounds of Mr. Harpending, being further considered, especially in regard to removing of the difficulties which might arise, it was resolved that the yearly interest of the seven lots still remaining which the church had formerly bought in the grounds, should be given for a perpetual income for the ground on which the church is to be built, so that thus the object of Mr. Harpending's will may be obtained. And that this shall be placed among the other matters which are signed by in- coming consistories.
2. Mr. Bancker reported that Valentyn had nothing but a house for which he demanded £15., and promised to give a bond for the £20. The matter is further referred to Mr. Bancker; and to execute the agreement made with Capt. Clarke. Signed etc.,
Lambertus de Ronde, p. t. President.
New York, June 18th, 1767.
Consistory held after calling on God's name.
The Consistory having further considered the length and breadth of the Third Church, Resolved, That it should be according to Mr. Breestede's plans: 100 feet long and 70 broad, within; and that the committee should proceed to agree with the masons, and also the stone cutters for the mason work, and to provide materials, at least so far that the foundation may be laid this year. The said com- mittee shall also buy thick and thin plank, and lay them up to dry, and shall pay for these materials out of the subscription list moneys, which they shall re- ceive from Mr. Isaac Roosevelt, who has been appointed to receive the said moneys from time to time, and render due account thereof.
Also Resolved, That the Tower of the Church shall be set 10 feet back from Horse and Cart street, and the breadth of the church or foundation stand in the middle of the designated grounds between the two side streets.
Signed, Lambertus de Ronde, p. t. President.
ACTS OF THE CLASSIS OF AMSTERDAM.
Synodalia, 1767. Art. 8. Orange Nassau. The Classis cordially wishes that the most precious blessings from the All- Sufficient God, may abide unto length of days upon His Illustrious Highness, the Lord Prince, Netherland's Hereditary Stadtholder, and upon the House of Orange Nassau; and by continuance, rec- ommends all that is appropriate to this lemma, to the Messrs. Depp. xiv. 122.
Synodalia, 1767. Art. 48. New York and New Jersey .- The Classis has nothing further to report to Synod, as to New York and New Jersey. xiv. 126.
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ECCLESIASTICAL RECORDS
1767
REMONSTRANCE AGAINST PREACHING IN ENGLISH IN THE DUTCH
REFORMED CHURCH IN NEW YORK. JULY 6, 1767.
To his Excellency Sir Henry Moore, Baronet, Captain General and Governor in Chief in and over the Province of New York and the Territorles depending thereon In America; Chancellor and Vice Admiral of the same; And to his Majesty's Honor- able Council of sald Province in Council Assembled.
Whereas several Persons appointed to Act, as well for themselves as many other Members of the Reformed Protestant Dutch Church of the City of New York in North America did by their Petition and humble Remonstrance presented to your Excellency and his Majesty's Honorable Council of the said Province the sixth Day of December 1766, shew and set forth the Eighth article of Capitulation on the Dutch surrendering this Colony to the Crown of Great Britain in 1664; King Willlam the Third's Charter or Letters Patent dated the Eleventh Day of May 1696 Confirming the said Article and Granting unto the sald Dutch Reformed Church other Liberties and Privileges than those contained in the sald Capitula- tion; and also an Act of the Lieutenant Governor Council and General Assembly of the sald Province, confirmed at St James's the Twenty-fifth Day of February 1755 by King George the second in Council, whereby the suld Liberties and privi- leges were further established and confirmed and others granted to the Ministers, Elders, Deacons and Members of the said Church, together with other matters and divers Grievances therein contained and complained of. And thereby prayed (Inter alla) speedy Relief etc. as by the said Petition and Remonstrance Relation being thereunto had will more at large appear.
And whereas your Excellency hath directed that a short account of the several Grievances complained of should be drawn up in writing to be lald before your Excellency and the Honorable Connell aforesald.
Now therefore, wo the several persons appointed as aforesaid, do, in the most brief nranner we are able, lay before your Excellency and his Majesty's Honorable Connell aforesald our several Grievances und Complaints as fol- lows, vlz.
First-That a Party of the Members of the sald Church called the English Party to the number of not more than one hundred and twenty three petitioned for an English Minister to be Introduced into the Dutch Church. That this being dellb- erately considered, a Protest was there upon delivered to the Consistory signed by two hundred and twenty six members of the said Church setting forth that by the 51st Article of the Constitution of the said Reformed Protestant Dutch Church Government two languages conld not be made use of under one Consistory.
Secondiy-That the sald party have In opposition to the Constitution of the said Church Government destroyed the 86th Article thereof; for that Article says, that although the Benefit of the Church shonid require It. Yet no alterations therein should be made, as by the said Article will fully appear.
Thirdly-That the Church Rules direct that no Minister shall be forced Into the Congregation against the will of such Congregation; And yet this has been done by Introducing Mr. Leadly who had but about the one hundred and twenty three Members of the sald Church.
Fourthly-That the laying out the monles arising by the Sale of the Manor of Fordham lu the purchase of other lands according to the direction of the Act of the Lieutenant Governor, Council and General Assembly, hath not been done.
Fifthly-That the Land of Mr. Harpending lays in a great measure waste and divers Houses fit to Rent are pulled down to build a Church upon to preach English In, Contrary to the Testator's Will.
Sixthly-That the Catechising in the Dutch Language Is forbidden by one of the Elders, alledging it was a Detriment to Mr. Leadly. And Mr. Leadly had forbidden Mr. Leydecker (who was qualified for that Business) to catechise, and say'd that the Consistory did not approve of it.
Seventhiy-That the Dutch School Is not taken Care of by the Rulers to the total Ruin of the Dutch Education.
Eighthly-That the Dutch are deprived of the Forenoon Service in the New Church in open violation of the Rights and against the Will of those who bought their Seats to hear the Dutch Service And that the Holy Ordinance of the Lord's
OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK.
4095
1767
Supper has not been performed since Mr. Leadly's being in the said Church by any Minister but himself.
Ninthly-That both the old and new Churches are ruled by the English Party and because the Dutch Party would not acknowledge them to be their lawful Rulers they forbid several of the Members the Sacrament.
Tenthly-That the Rulers would force the Dutch, who can't understand Mr. Leadly; to acknowledge him to be their lawful Teacher; and declare that he must and shall be one in Communion with the Dutch, who never commune with him because they cannot understand him; and if he is one in Communion with the Dutch, he is Intitled to the Revenue of the Dutch Ministers.
All which matters and Grievances we most humbly submit to the most serious Consideration of Your Excellency and his Majesty's said Honorable Council; And pray a speedy Decision of and Relief in the Premises.
For which (as in Duty bound) we shall ever pray etc.
Abel Hardenbrook Jacobus Stoutenburgh Huybt. V. Wagenen.
-Doc. Hist. N. Y. Vol. iii. pp. 308, 309.
July 6, 1767. [See Nov. 11, 1767.]
REPORT OF THE LORDS OF TRADE AGAINST THE PETITION OF THE
PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH OF NEW YORK, WALL ST. [SEE MARCH 24, 1767.]
Whitehall, June 10, 1767.
To the Right Honorable the Lords of the Committee of His Majesty's Most Honorable Privy Council for Plantation Affairs.
My Lords.
We have had under our consideration a petition to His Majesty of the present Ministers Elders Deacons and Trustees of the Presbyterian Church of the City of New York, humbly praying for the reasons therein contained that His Majesty will be graciously pleased to create them a Body Politic and Corporate, by the name and stile of the Ministers Elders Deacons and trustees of the Presbyterian Church of the City of New York, according to the Westminster confession of Faith, Catechisms, and directory, agreeable to the present established Church of Scotland, and that they and their successors may be thereby enabled, under the Great Seal of the Province to hold and enjoy the said Church, and ground belonging to the same, and to acquire and hold a further estate and enjoy such other powers and privileges as may be necessary for the encouragement of religious worship ; and that His Majesty will be graciously pleased to grant them such other aid, protection and countenance as to his royal wisdom shall seem meet.
This petition was referred to this Board by an order of His Majesty in Council on the 28th of May, 1766, with direction to consider the same and report an opinion thereupon to your Lordships, and it appearing as well upon the face of the petition itself as from other papers in possession of the Board that many proceedings had been had before the Council of New York touching an application of the Presbyterian Church there, for a Charter of Incorporation, it was thought advisable to transmit a copy of the petition to the Governor there, with directions to communicate the same to the Council for their advice and information thereupon, and to report in the fullest manner the present state and condition of this Protestant Establishment, and also all the proceedings upon a petition to the same effect presented to them during the administration of Lieutenant Governor Colden and the reason why such applica- tion did not succeed at that time.
In return to this reference to the Governor of New York he has lately transmitted to us a report made to him thereupon by a Committee of His Majesty's Council there ; a copy whereof we beg leave to annex hereunto.
This report will fully inform your Lordships of the true state of the proceedings and precedents to which the petition to His Majesty refers, and does likewise state a doubt of great weight and importance in this question, viz., whether His Majesty
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ECCLESIASTICAL RECORDS
1767
consistent with the obligation he is under by his Coronation Oath, founded on the Act of the 5th of Queen Anne Cap. 5. intituled "An Act for securing the Church of England as by Law established," can create such an establishment in favour of the Presbyterian Church as is now requested.
This, my Lord, is a question of too great importance for us to decide upon; but upon the fullest consideration of what is stated in the report of the Council of New York we are of opinion that independent of the objection arising out of this ques- tion, it Is not expedlent, upon principles of general policy, to comply with the prayer of this petition or to give the Presbyterian Church of New York any other privileges and immunities than it Is Intitled to by the laws of Toleration.
We are, my Lords, Your Lordships most obedient
and most humble Servants
Clare Wm. Fitzherbert Thomas Robinson.
-Col. Docs. N. Y. Vol. vll, pp. 943-4.
CHURCH OF NEW YORK. The Dutch Party. The New Church. New York, July 21, 1767.
Consistory held after calling on God's name.
1. Abel Hardenbrock, Jacobus Stoutenberg and Huybert Van Wagenen presented a copy of the petition which they had preferred to the Governor and Couneli on the 6th of July. This was received and held for consideration.
2. The widow of Josepli de Voe was taken as a poor person to be provided for by the Deacons.
3. The committee asked for further orders of the Consistory, to go ou with the bulldiug of the New Church according to their pleasure. These were given to them, and Peter Lott, Cornelius Bogart and Adrlaan Bancker added thereto.
4. Hereafter no one shall be taken up as a poor person to be supported by the Church, unless on condition that whatever may be bequeathed to them shall fall to the church.
Signed, Lambertus de Ronde, p. t. President.
ACTION OF SYNOD OF NORTH HOLLAND JULY 28-AUG. 6, 1767. VOL. 65.
ARTICLE 44. Views of " The German Church " on American Ordinations.
The question of being permitted to examine and promote persous, should clr- cumstances require It, was again discussed.
1. It was settled that the brethren had no thought of cutting themselves loose from the Christlan Synods of South and North Holland and the Rev. Classis of Amsterdam, or of seeking higher authority than that which God and the Church Order appoint for them; that it had never been their Intention to give offense In word or act to the Christian Synods and the Classis; but that they take pleasure rather in gratefully acknowledging the great benefits conferred on them; and, therefore, whatever, In former acts, may have given reason for grief and Indigna- tion must be ascribed, not to their hearts, but to thelr luexperience in the use of the Holland language. They ask to be excused therefor, as their consciences de- clare them free from every base disposition, intended offence and Ingratitude.
OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK.
4097 1767
2. They ask permission that, whenever circumstances require it, they may examine and ordain men, referring to the examples of Revs. Templeman and du Bols in the time of Rev. Schlatter, and citing two cases which exist there at present. There are two or three churches, the chief place is Caryl, one church new, which are situated in the mountains, 40, 50 or 60 miles distant from the nearest ministers. Those people seek help; but not one of us can go there, perchance, more than once a year. They dare not call a minister from Germany, because they are too poor to support him. A man presents himself, not without providential guidance, whom the Lord has made willing to minister to those people. With all dilgence, he Is bent on knowing the truth and presenting it to the people. Besides he makes no objection to the poverty of his hearers. Three or four years after the church was organized, they appear before the Coetus ask- ing it to examine and ordain this man who has ministered to them so long. The Coetus takes a year to think it over; to investigate the character and conduct of that man. Agaln they appear with their minister, making the same request. What Is the Coetus to do? To refuse is to keep the church unsettled; to send to Holland is impracticable, owing to the poverty of the church, the minister's family, and the necessity of leaving the church for nine or ten months without religious services. We leave It to your Revs. gracious judgment what is best to do under such circumstances.
Another example is to be added here. There is a church which has been sorely spoiled by a tramp, (landlooper). The good people had to keep themselves back, and the others came to see the fraud. Those people come and desire help from the Coetus-they want a regular minister. They cannot raise more than 30 pounds; and combination with other churches is impossible, because the church lies quite out of the way, and the nearest church is still fascinated by the tramp. We cannot call a minister on account of the salary that is required; but there is a man whom God's Spirit has converted and who understands theoretical and practical theology, and the rules of scriptural interpretation very well; is in life and conduct well fitted to edify a church, and has for two years lived with a minister so as to be the better fitted.
Said church hears that man, notices the difference between an honest and well-instructed minister and a tramp, and wants to call him. He is willing to come to their rescue, but not without order from the Coetus. They appear before the Coetus with the request that it examine and ordain this man. To Holland the man cannot be sent. The candidate dares not cross the sea. The church also cannot wait the length of time that would take, on account of the tramp, who resides in the neighborhood, and 'still seeks and has a following in that church. This would surely cause fresh confusion and division. We know the man intimately, as being well qualified, and have the surest hope of help from him. In this case, what should the Coetus undertake to do?
These things are not imaginary; they are the truth and nothing but the truth. These cases are before us. Our aim is by no means to ignore the Rev. Fathers, to cut ourselves loose, to exalt ourselves. Oh no! We are satisfied with the state we are in. But to have the hands tied altogether, is too hard, while yet we must labor faithfully for the Lord. We want nothing to elevate ourselves in authority, but only what can be of service to our Lord and to His Kingdom. All other thoughts are banished from our minds. We do but wish that New York, Pennsylvanla, Maryland and Virginia were as well known to the Rev. Fathers as they are to us. There would be no difference at all then in our correspondence, and our sincere desires would be fulfilled. Therefore, the care, the love, the zeal and the beneficence of the Synods and of the Classis of Amsterdam lead us also to hope for a good result and a right answer for our churches.
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