USA > Pennsylvania > Colonial records of Pennsylvania, Vol. II > Part 24
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At a Council held at Philadia., ye 8th of ye 11 mo., 1705.
PRESENT :
John Guest,
Wm. Trent,
Thomas Story, Esq'rs. Jos. Pidgeon, James Logan.
Jasper Yeats,
A Bill of fees, as Presented to this Board by the House, was re- turned by ye Secry., together with an accot of the Officers fees as by them presented to this Board and referred to the Consideration of the Assembly.
The Bill for affirmations as last presented by the house, was again taken into Consideration, and Debated & referred.
A Message from the Assembly, by S. Carpenter & J. Norris, re- turned to this Board the two Bills for Elections of members of assem- bly and of Sherifs & Coroners, amended by the House according to
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the proposals made by this Board, only that in the Bill for Electing of Sherifs, &c. the House (upon view of the sd Bill) Seemed to have expunged the last Proviso, together with the last but one objected to by this Board.
Ordered That Thomas Story carry the Bill to the House, & in- form them, that unless the last proviso stands, the Govr. cannot agree to the Bill.
The said members of Assembly also brought up the Bill for Regu- lating of Money, as agreed to by the House upon the Petition sent to them the 5th Instant, Signed by severall of the Inhabitants of Philadia. Also the Bill for preserving the Highways, as agreed to by the House with alterations.
The said members also brought in again ye Bill for a better Cor- respondence with the Indians, desiring in the name of the assembly, that the Bill might Pass as sent up by the House, wth the Limita- tion of £50 for ye Charges of one year, and that the said Limitation & the Clause Relating thereunto, might be blotted out of the Bill for Raising a supply for Support of Governmt.
Adjourned till 3 in the afternoon.
POST MERIDIEM, The same as before.
The Council being mett, and it being represented that the Assem- bly is exceedingly desirous for this time to depart, & therefore de- sire that what Bills lay before this Board may be expedited. The Bill for Confirming Grants & Patents from the Proprir., &c., was read & Debated, & upon ye Debates it is, 1. Ordered, That instead of the first Clause in this Bill, the first Generall clause in the bill of Property so Called, past at New Castle, be Inserted in its place.
2. That the Clause beginning at line 27th, obliging ye Propr. to appoint Commissrs. upon reasonable Demands to Confirm all Lands, &c., to be Left out as being unfit for the Governr. to pass without the Proprs. immediate assent.
3. That instead of ye ten Acres allowed by the Pror. (line 17th) be inserted ye 4 acres allowed by the Proprietr. for difference of survey, & ye 6 acres allowed for Roads & Barrens. Page 2d, line 4, Insert after seals, pursuant to the Powers from him derived.
Line 26, that for Nature kinds qualities or quantities, be read natures kind or Qualities.
Line 37, That ye whole clause of warrantee or Saving harmless, be left out as being too much for ye Govr. to pass without the Pro prietrs. assent first had. That instead of the Last clause wch deter. mines J. Growdons & J. Tathams Exrs. case now in dispute, without hearing it, there be an Exception of ye sd. J. Growdon's case, & that it be left to ye Law as if this act had never been made. That in. stead of Wm. Penn after ye first time the Proprir. be always Read
At a Council held at Philadia., the 9th of ye 11 mo., 1705.
PRESENT :
John Guest,
Wm. Trent,
Thom. Story,
Jasper Yeats, 1 Esq'rs.
Jos. Pidgeon, J. Logan.
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Amendmts. to the Bill Intituled an act to Confirm Grants & Pa- tents, & for prevention of Law suitt, were drawn up as formerly agreed on, (vid. amendmts.) wth a preamble as a message aquainting the House that the said act chiefly affecting the Proprir., who is one party throughout the whole, & therefore ought to be Consulted upon Every particular, he thought it rather Belonged Immediately to the Proprietr. than to himself to Consider it, that he might make it as it truly ought to be, his own proper act & deed, for wch End the Go- verneur had already sent away two Copies of it and Doubted not but he should Receive a favourable answer before the year of the present assembly's Service is Expired, Yet least the People should be uneasy in not being Settled, ye Govr. is willing to pass the act in the mean- time with the same amendmts.
Judge Yeates and the Secrety. were sent to the house with the Bill directing the Qualifications of officers and affirmations, and the Bill for impowering Religious Societies, Counties, &c., to buy and sell Lands, concerning which they were ordered to inform the House. As to the first that the Governour was very willing ye Countrey should be made easy upon that head, but that if they could find a method to Excuse him from being an actor in it he would take it as a favour, that therefore he proposed either that the House would, (as he had proposed before,) agree to draw up the Bill exactly ac- cording to Queens Ordr. about Oaths & affirmations in this Province, or if they Could not fully come up to this, that they would be Con- tent ye act should not be in force till it received the Queens sanction, or otherwise that they would draw up such a Bill as would best suit them and send it over to the Proprietor to sollicit the Royal Sanc- tion, He being the only proper person to ingage in the Business that so much concerns the Quakers as a People.
To the other Bill for Impowering religious Societies, &c., They are ordered to acquaint the House That the Governr. is of opinion such a Bill may be reasonable & necessary for the Country, but he had some particular reasons why he cannot agree to it as now drawn, yet is willing that in some little time it may pass wth such amend- ments as shall be concluded when he had taken further advice upon it, which he will Speedily take care to do. And further that what Bills were agreed on, the Governr. is willing to pass and end this session as soon as they please, those that were sent up being mostly engrossed & ready as the secry. informed.
A Bill also prepared at this Board, directing the order of pay- ments of Debts left out in the Bill for Intestates Estates, was sent by the said members to the House for their Concurrence. The said two members returning, reported that they had delivered their mes- sage as given them in Charge, and then adjourned to two in the afternoon.
-
9th, POST MERIDIEM.
The same as before.
A message from the Assembly of 6 of their Principal members, VOL. II .- 10
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viz : Edward Shippen, Samll. Carpenter, Coll. Pusey, Rd. Hill, David Lloyd and Isaac Norris. That the House having taken into consideration the message sent to them from this Board in the morning, had come to a Result thereupon, & ordered ym to Repre- sent to the Governr. That the assembly had now sate long, and had laboured to the best of their abilities, (and not without good hopes) to bring matters to such a Close as might prove most benifi- cial to the Country they represented. That among all those matters the Countrey would stand mostly in need of, there was none of greater Importance to them, and what they would more sensibly feel the want of than the Bill directing the Qualifications of Officers, and the manner of giving Evidence, that should they return home with- out answering the Exigencies of the People in this Point whatever they could effect, besides would be insufficient to atone for so great a Neglect, they hoped that what they craved they should be very ca- pable to make appear indisputably to be their due, and that seeing they had advanced to the utmost of their power to answer the Queens Ordr. about oaths & affirmations, and that upon an impartial view the Bill they had last offered would be found no way repugnant to that ordr., they hoped it would meet with no further delay, & there- fore earnestly besought the Governour to take the Bill further into Consideration before this session be over. They also requested the Governour to answr. the Countreyes desire in the other Bill, for Im- powering religious Societies, Counties, &c., to sell and buy Land, being likewise of very great Importance to ye People.
Arguments to the same purpose were much pressed by all the said members, and then they withdrew.
The Governour and Council spending some time in debate upon ye said message, It was Resolved, that the House should be forth- with acquainted by a message from this Board, That the Governr. is much troubled, the assembly could not be satisfied with any of the three Proposals he he had made to them in the morning, but seeing they are come to this resolution still to press it further, if they are willing to have the matter debated, he will agree to a Conference to be held this Evening, either with the whole House or such members as they shall appoint,
The Secretary's ordered to carry the said message, who return- ing, reports that he had delvd. it accordingly, and that the assembly embraces the proposal and will attend the Governr. as soon as they can put themselves in Order.
All the members in town except the Speaker, who being indis- posed could not come, attended the Governour for the proposed Con- ference and largely debated ye matter.
The Governour told them He would have been heartily glad if they could have agreed to any of the Proposals he had made them this morning, because tho' many might look upon the Bill to be reasonable, yet in as much as it interferes with her Ma'ties. Order, which must be always a Rule to him, he thought it very unsafe in any point to act inconsistently wth it.
The Atty. Genll., (G. Lowther,) being sent for, it was alledged
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by such of this Board as profess the Law, (vizt. : J. Guest,) toge- ther with the said attorney, That in Capital cases there was no Power granted, or could be granted by the Royal Charter, to make a law by which a man should be tried for his life, but by a Jury sworn according to ye Law of Engld.
Upon which the argument was divided into two heads, first, whether the Governr. and assembly have any such Power as to make a Law, that an affirmation in this Province shall in all cases where the Plantation acts require not Oaths, be equivalent to an oath, and next how far 'tis prudent or safe to enact any such Law, admit there be such a power, till such time as the Queens Pleasure be known therein.
On the first head it was after a full debate Resolved and Concluded that the Power is sufficient, and such an Act is not contrary to Law, for several acts having been past here & sent home for the Queens approbation, when those acts have been presented to the attorney General to consider them in Law only, he has never objected to any act of the kind, tho' several Lawes of this Province have been enacted quite altering the method of Proceedings, in most or many of the Crimes that are capital in England, & further that were such as can- not swear excluded out of Juries in this Province it would prove a very great Insecurity to the People, for in Countrey places a Grand & Petty Jury could not be made up without them, unless they should almost wholly consist of Swedes & other foreigners in whom there would be a much less security.
To the 2d 'tis answered by the managers for the Assembly, that the Queens Ordr. seems not to have been designed as any hardship to any of her people of this place, but rather calculated in most points to answer the Circumstances of the Inhabitants, that this Bill now proposed, fully Comes up to the Queens Ordr. in every respect, if the words of the Ordr. be duly Considered ; for it leaves full liberty to all persons who are free to take Oaths to receive them from a proper Officer that can administer them, and those who cannot are to take the same affirmation, that is required by that Ordr.
'Tis Objected by the Governour that by this Bill an oath cannot in all cases be administered, tho' the party be willing to take it, be- cause it Enacts that where the magistrate cannot administer an oath, the affirmation shall pass and be taken in lieu thereof, but the Queens Order requires that an oath shall be administered to all persons who in England are obliged willing and to take one.
Answered by the Assembly, That seeing this Countrey was at first settled and is now chiefly inhabited by those called Quakers, who neither can take nor administer an Oath, some of those people as they have both right and merit on their side to have authority in a place themselves had made, so in several places of the Governmt., they must of necessity be in Commission, or there will be none found for the magistracy, & this even the Queens Order plainly implies by allowing an affirmation to be as good a qualification of a Judge or Magistrate as an oath, but should the same Ordr. require these per- sons to doe what is certainly known before hand they are incapable of,
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it would carry an incongruity with it, which is not fit to be imagined of any thing proceeding from the royal Authority, and the conse- quence would be to remove out of Office all those of that Profession, or at least to incapacitate them (which is equivalent) to discharge their duties therein.
Replied by this Board that there are several of that Profession still in Commisso. and especially in the Counties of Bucks and Chester, where there is a manifest necessity for it, yet they act and discharge their Trusts very well notwithstanding the Queens Ordr. is generally put in practice there.
Rejoined by the Assembly, That it will always be the same after this act is passed, that in the Courts, if there be any magistrate present who can administer an oathe he now administers it when re- quired, that so it will also be here after Provision being made for this in the Bill. But the hardship is, that if any Criminal or Delin- quent be brought before a private magistrate who cannot swear, (as 'tis impossible to find sufficient setts of Justices in each County that can swear, or if at any time there should hapen to be no Jurant magistrate in the Court, which by the care that is taken can but very rarely happen,) if this Criminal desire any Evidence to be sworn, un- less his desire is complied wth the Proceedings by the Queens order are to be void & the Justice falls short in his Duty, to privent which and such other falures, as well as to make ye affirmation legal proof, even from one called a Quaker. This bill is designed, and therefore never can be displeasing to the ministry, nor can be construed to bear any repugnancy to the Queens Ordr. which was certainly in- tended to bring matters to a greater regularity, and not to involve the place in reason of its particular Circumstances into the greatest perplexity. However they Humbly request that it may be enacted here, and presented to the Queen who they doubt not will be gra- cionsly pleased to favour it if duly represented wth her royal appro- bation.
They also requested that the Governour would be pleased to pass that other Bill for Empowering Religious Societies to receive and dispose of Lands for their necessary uses, without which the People would be greatly wronged, not having a spot of Ground in the whole Countrey, (tho., by Incouragement from the Crown they at first duly purchased & afterwards by their Labour & Estates improved it) either for a publick meeting House, Burying Ground, or such other uses that they can call their own, if this be once disputed, a Proceeding, which at their first venturing their Estates and families to make this the Colony that it now is, they never Expected to see, and are now very much surprised to find the least hesitation made upon it.
The Governr. promised to take care about it, but could not, he said, pass the Bill this session, that however they need not appre- hend their losing it, and then the Conference ended.
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At A Council held at Philadia., the 12th January, 1705.
PRESENT :
The Lieutenant Governour.
John Guest,
Joseph Pidgeon,
Thomas Story, Esq'rs.
James Logan.
Willm. Trent,
The Governour laid before the Board an address that he last night recevd. from the assembly, delvd. to him by the greatest part of the Represents. in a Body together with the Bill directing the Qualifica- tions of officers & the manner of giving Evidence as they last agreed upon it, which address was read and was as follows.
To the Honble. John Evans, Esqr., Governr. of the Province of Pensilvania, &c. the address of the Representatives of the freemen of the said Province in Assembly met.
Humbly Sheweth :
That whereas, our Proprietary Governr. Wm. Penn, Esqr., by his Charter of Priviledges granted to the free People of this Province amongst other things therein mentioned, that the assembly of the said Province shall set yearly at Philadelphia, Except ye Governr & assembly shall think fit to appoint another place. And for as much as Philadia. wch has hitherto been the place of session, is without State house, Court house, or other publick Building to sett in, and that the representatives have been usually under difficulties to get a convenient room for that service, and the Country members have some- time paid for the use of a room out of their own private Purses and at this time with much struggling they have hardly avoided a General Charge.
Therefore the humble Request of the Representatives of the said Province in assembly met, is that it may please the Governour to order that for the future, Assemblies may be held in Each County alternately, and that the next session of Assembly may be at Chester, & the next then following at Bucks, and the next after that at Phi- ladia., and so successively forever hereafter, Except the Governour and assembly shall see cause to appoint otherwise.
The said address being referred, & the said Bill for Qualification of Officers being taken into Consideration, It was after several de- bates, resolved and agreed to by the Governour, that seeing nothing short of that Bill would content the assembly, and they so forcibly urged their reasons for it, It should pass wth this alteration, vizt. : that the act should not be in force till after a Certain time, in which it might be presented to the Queen or Board of Trade & Plantations to Consider of it, for which time the first of 8br. next was agreed on, and an amendment to the Bill was made accordingly. Ordered, that Judge Guest and the Secry. carry the said Bill to the House, and inform them that the Governr. cannot any otherwise agree to it than as now proposed, That he must defer the other Bill Impowering Re- ligious Societies, &c., to their next meeting. That he is very de- sirous the present session should this day End with the week, that all the Bills are Engrossed that have been agreed to, and if the assembly
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can be satisfied with the amendment now sent, they are desired im- mediately to return it to the Secry. that it may be Ingrossed, & ready with the rest to receive the Governours sanction, this after- noon about 4 of the Clock, at which time the whole House is required to attend the Governr., & to adjourn themselves to the Council Chamber, that they may be there treated with as an House upon some points that will arise, which time will not allow them to settle by messages.
The said members returning, reported they had delivered their message, that the Speaker told them that he would lay what they had said before the House, and yt they would take care with all dis- patch to send an answer.
A message from the Assembly presented to the Governour the Bill directing the Ordr. of payment of Debts of persons deceased, which was sent to them from this Board, agreed to by the House with some amendments, as also the Bill directing the Qualifications of officers, &c., agreed to likewise by the House, only that they requested the Governr. the act might take place sometime in the month of 7br., that so it might be in force before ye time that the present annual assembly should be over, which Ends with 7br. Adjourned to four in the afternoon. Agreed that instead of the 1st of 8br., it should be made ye 20th of 7br.
POST MERIDIEM, Ho. 4ti. Iidem.
The Speaker, with the whole assembly, waited on the Governour in ye Council Chamber, & being all sate, the Governour informed them that he must now put an End to the present session, which he would do by passing the Bills that were prepared. But proceeded to acquaint them, that in the Bill provided for the support of Go- vernment, there was one thing which he Could not approve of, viz : That one moiety of the money Raised for the service of the Publick was left intirely at the disposal of the assembly, without any regard to the Governour, that as the assembly could raise no money without the Governrs. Consent, so it is unreasonable that they should have the Intire disposal of it without him, when raised by his authority, that no assembly ought to have a fund in their own hands to convert to such uses as they should think fit, & therefore he desired he would amend it. The Speaker represented, that tho' what was proposed might be very reasonable, yet as ye Bill was past by the House, so they could not alter any thing in it without a vote, wch they could not properly do here.
The Governr. proposed to leave the Council Chamber to them, & adjourn for sometime, which was done.
A message from the Speaker acquainted the Governour that the House was ready to wait on him, & had left the Council Chamber.
The Governr. & Council coming to the Board, the Speaker repre- sented to the Governr. that the House had Largely debated the mat- ter proposed to them, & had upon a vote come to a resolution to pray the Governr. to pass the Bill without any amendment.
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Upon which the matter was resumed, and the Case being more clearly stated, It was agreed, that the assembly should have no power to dispose of any of ye sd money, but for discharge of debts now in- cumbent on the Province, & for ye necessary Charges of their own house, and that in all other cases the Governrs Concurrence with the assembly should be required.
All the Bills prepared this session being Ingrossed & Examined by ye Comittee appointed by the assembly were Laid in order, & being severally presented to ye Govr. he passed into Laws the following 50 Acts, viz :
1. The Law for Liberty of Conscience.
2. An Act against murder & manslaughter.
3. An Act against Burglary.
4. An Act against Robbing & Stealing.
5. An Act to Restrain People from Labour on the first day of the Week.
6. An Act against Rape or Ravishment.
7. An Act against Incest
8. An Act agst. Adultery & Fornication.
9. An Act against Bigamy.
10. An Act against Sodomy & Buggery.
11. An Act against Burning of Houses.
12. An Act against Drunkenness & drinking of Healths.
13. An Act against riotous Sports, Plays & Games.
14. An Act against Riots & Rioters.
15. An Act Limiting the Presentmts of ye Grand Jury.
16. An Act for determing of debts under for Shills.
17. An Act for ye further securing ye administration of ye Go- vernmt. of this province.
18. An Act for the better Confirmation of the Owners of Lands & Inhabitants of this Province in their just Rights & Possessions.
19. An Act concerning ye Probates of written & nuncupative wills & for Confirming Devises of Lands.
20. An Act directing the Order of Payment of Debts of Persons deceased.
21. An Act for the better settling of Intestates Estates.
22. An Act for ye Acknowledging & Recording of Deeds.
23. An Act to ascertain the number of members of Assembly, & to regulate the Elections.
24. An Act for selling Beer & ale by wine measure.
25. An Act for the more Easy & Effectually Collecting of the Proprietrs. Quittrents.
26. An Act about Departers out of this Province.
27. An Act for the Better Improving a Good Correspondence with the Indians.
28. An Act about attachments.
29. An act for the Tryal of Negroes.
30. An act to prevent ye Importation of Indian Slaves.
31. The Law about 7 Years quiet Possession.
32. An Act for the killing of wolves.
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33. An Act against mixing & adulterating strong Liquors.
34. An Act for mariners not to be trusted.
35. An Act for County Seals & against Counterfeiting hands & seals.
36. An Act for Defalcation.
37. An Act for Bailing of Prisoners & about Imprisonment.
38. An Act for taking Lands in Execution for Payment of Debts.
39. An Act about arrests & making Debtors pay by servitude.
40. An Act for the Relief of the Poor.
41. An Act for Confirming the sales of Lands by Attorneys or Agents for ascertaining ye Proof of ye Instruments or writings made out of this province.
42. An Additional act for ye better preserving the highways.
43. A Supplementary Act to that about raising County Levies.
44. An Act to prevent ye running of swine at Large.
45. An Act for Collecting the arrears of Two thousd. Pounds, granted to ye Proprs.
46. An Act directing ye Qualifications of all magistrates & offi- cers, as also ye mannr. of giving Evidence.
47. An Act for regulatg. Elections of Sheriffs & Coroners.
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